Portal   Forum   Members   Market   Gallery   Events

stupid religious people

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by dapork, Oct 5, 2002.

  1. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2000
    Messages:
    25,759
    Likes Received:
    27
    Market Rating:
    16
    don't complain about this thread. only post in it if you have something to contribute. this post and other posts that don't contribute to this thread will be deleted in a day or two.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2002
  2. dapork

    dapork Peasant

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2001
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    1
    Market Rating:
    0
    Well agree that this whole thing is going in circles. So haite, don't bother reading this if you don't want to, and I'm getting tired of this "debate" myself. I think we'd have to have some greater knowledge in physics to take this any further.

    I just personally believe that science has yet to solve this "disorder."

    I don't expect science to suddenly answer these problems, but perhaps one day. And I still believe there is no evidence of god.
     
  3. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2000
    Messages:
    25,759
    Likes Received:
    27
    Market Rating:
    16
    science hasn't. religion has, but not using scientific methods. you and i think science is the end all be all. haite believes in faith as well as science from what i have gathered.
     
  4. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2001
    Messages:
    9,325
    Likes Received:
    34
    Market Rating:
    0
    Religion still follows the same analytical methods (at least Catholicism does) as science, but it gets applied in a metaphysical sense, a subject that is unofficially "politically incorrect" in physical science.

    As I've tried to point out, faith is a misnomer since it's applied in science as well (but on physical, rather than metaphysical contexts).
     
  5. dapork

    dapork Peasant

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2001
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    1
    Market Rating:
    0
    Well you know, no religious people in the middle-ages believed in science as well as religion. It began later that religious people found ways to justify their faith scientifically to strengthen it. (my opinion)
     
  6. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2000
    Messages:
    25,759
    Likes Received:
    27
    Market Rating:
    16
    my definition of faith is claiming something to be true without scientific proof.
     
  7. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2001
    Messages:
    9,325
    Likes Received:
    34
    Market Rating:
    0
    As is mine. For clarity I would also say that my definition of proof is something that holds true in any scenario to which it is relevant, beyond the specific examples mankind has observed.

    A perfect example is the Angle Addition Postulate: a larger angle "always" equals the sum of any smaller angles contained in it. From all our experiences so far, this holds true. However, the universe is assumed as ten-dimensional to satisfy modern superstring theory (theory explaining the fundamental form of matter), so what happens when you get down to angles with measurements the width of subatomic particles? We postulate that the other 6 dimensions, since they're obviously not noticable at our level of size, have curved up to incredibly small size since the cooling of the universe after the big bang. We haven't gotten down to measurements that small since we only know of the existance of the particles indirectly (we have no technology to measure that small).
     
  8. dapork

    dapork Peasant

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2001
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    1
    Market Rating:
    0
    You know how you guys say the correct scientific method is disproving something before out ruling it? Well we're been studying the STANDARD scientific method this year, and this is how it goes (I'm filling in each part with my opinion, and testing that):

    -State problem: "is there a god?"

    -Gather information: "check to see if this experiment has be performed already, and read books or journals on the matter"

    -Make a hypothesis: "I predict that there is no god"

    -Perform the experiment: "gather information and solid possible proof leading to the existance of a god"

    -Analyse data: "study gathered clues, put them in a graph etc..."

    -Conclusion: "I could not find any proof to the existance of a god"

    -Declare findings: "there is no god"

    Ok that was it, and if you ask me, that looks ALOT more like proving something before accepting it instead of having to disprove it.

    [hr]

    Now, remember that experiment I was talking about where amino acids were created from substances thought to have been on the early earth?
    Here's the linkage!
    http://tidepool.st.usm.edu/crswr/millerurey.html
     
  9. mud

    mud Peasant

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2000
    Messages:
    1,675
    Likes Received:
    0
    Market Rating:
    0
    I would just like to point out, that nothing sceintific is ever proven correct, it just becoems the accpeted norm until somethings disproves it. Based upon empirical evidence I believe in that which can be expiremnted on and tested.
     
  10. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2000
    Messages:
    25,759
    Likes Received:
    27
    Market Rating:
    16
    it is very possible the proof you seek has yet to be discovered. declaring that god does not exist is just as absurd as declaring that he does exist. the correct answer is, "i do not know."
     
  11. dapork

    dapork Peasant

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2001
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    1
    Market Rating:
    0
    I was just giving examples to give you guys an idea. JESUS CHRIST! CALMS DOWN JAKE!!!!
     
  12. kraahl

    kraahl Peasant

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2002
    Messages:
    2,332
    Likes Received:
    2
    Market Rating:
    0
    In my opinion there many things that points at god not existing and not many things gives anything remotley like proof for "his" existance.
    The does not exist side weights heavier then the does exist side. This is, however, not proof. So I think I can safely assume that since there´s no evidence for god´s existance, he/she does not exist. I don´t find that absurd at all.

    We can say that, if god exist and has any power in this world. THEN HE IS NO GOOD GOD. A good god wouldn´t let 40k children die every day.
    Sometimes they show sucky american tv-shows in sweden about people being close to death (disasters and such). Everyone says "I think god was with me" and "I prayed to god"
    I find the thought that god should hear the prayer of a tiny american while ignoring other people dying from war, cancer, etc. disgusting. Why does this god of yours (not directed to anyone in particular) save an american whose faith isn´t very strong when there´s people with much stronger faith in the "lord" are dying all the time.
    If god exists he´s not very nice.
     
  13. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2000
    Messages:
    25,759
    Likes Received:
    27
    Market Rating:
    16
    yeah, examples of scientific method. but that example was not using scientific method. it made a huge assumption to reach a conclusion... a conclusion you claim to be correct. that doesn't make sense.
     
  14. Beeble

    Beeble Peasant

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2000
    Messages:
    2,699
    Likes Received:
    2
    Market Rating:
    0
    the 40k children? God gives us choices. The country figurehead over there can't solve the problem. Thus they die. Poverty= need for donation. He [God] knows about that, but maybe he wants the children elsewhere for a.. divine appointment of some sort. yes, many questions remain truly unanswerable. my mother has seen both sides of life, a faithful to christianity and a hellborne one. She has experienced God firsthand through worship, as have I, the feeling is that of an intense peace- impossible to describe in words.As for the strong-faithed people dying, they may have been needed by God elsewhere.

    The root of all evil is in sin. God gave his one and only son to die on the cross. Death is rooted in sin. thanks to the original sins of Adam and Eve, sin and death has been wrought upon the world.
     
  15. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2001
    Messages:
    9,325
    Likes Received:
    34
    Market Rating:
    0
    Thank you Jake, I got tired of replying :D.
     
  16. Kwijibo

    Kwijibo Peasant

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2000
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    0
    Market Rating:
    0
    I find it pretty funny how people say why is there so much evil in the world and yet they live out their selfish lives, watching their 6 o' clock news thinking "wow look what happened, good thing it wasn't me cause i would have been like, screwed or something"
    not bothering to donate to charities or all the rest, but on the other side the commercials showing half starved babies with flies in the eyeballs eating their nose hairs isn't fair either, although it reveals the harsh reality of a third world country, meanwhile we complain about slightly burned chicken and throw the damn thing out...as i once said, ya know a terrorist would have suicide bomvbed you so his family could eat that chicken"
    anyways Life is made up of choices, what you do with your life may or may not impact the rest of the world, doesn't hurt to do something small and at least feel good that you helped and as for God, i believe there is some higher power and yet at the same time science helps comprehend lifes mysteries as well, i wonder what would happen if we combined em...wait...Church of Scientology comes to mind...lol "here take these personality tests" hehe
     

Hitometer: 53,946,882 since 1995