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Rogue: Shock and Awe Build

Discussion in 'Character Building' started by dcwilson26, May 12, 2006.

  1. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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  2. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    I know very little about rogues, but that seems decent to me based on what I do know. Maybe Kunai could give some input.
     
  3. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I have a rogue friend on Blackrock. I think he is gonna reply.
     
  4. Kunia

    Kunia MSC Footman

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    asdf

    Its fairly close to how im set up one thing you may want to change in subtely is to try and get preparation its awesome, pretty much makes it so you have two vanishes, two evasions, two sprints, two premeditations if used correctly. I'm set up 17/3/31. It's helped me in pvp and grinding solo not maximum damage yet it keeps me alive.
     
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  5. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    Is this mainly for PvP? What I'd like to point out is that there aren't that many worthy daggers outside MC or raiding. Your spec seems to concentrate on backstab/ambush which requires a dagger in mainhand. You also have points in dodge abilities (mainly for sword-spec'd rogues).

    So you have to make a decision; sword or dagger? Sword is mainly fighting the enemy face-on whereas dagger is just the opposite. Dagger rogues can ambush/backstab and kill a cloth-wearer in 2-3 hits but weak face to face vs most other classes. They rely on gouge and vanish more often than other rogues. Sword rogues are great all-around even though they don't get that backstab/ambush. They rely more on stunning via cheapshot, gouge, kidney shot. Riposte and deflection are a nice skill. Sword rogues can match a warrior face-on and win whereas a dagger rogue would most likely run from warriors unless they are decently (i.e. MC) equipped.

    I usually BG on my friend's rogue. He has a dagger rogue but he changes often so I get to try new builds. Gotta love being in a raid guild where gold is never an issue.
     
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  6. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    I probably won't be doing any PvP. This is all about solo'ing PvE.
     
  7. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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    your recent posts make me wonder if you're playing the same game as everyone else.


    i dont think daggers for soloing is a very good idea, at least not with a subtlety build. you wont be able to get the positioning for backstab.

    combat is generally regarded as the best for solo grinding/farming because you don't have to be behind the mob to get your dps. there is a combat dagger spec that i used to use for raids if you're interested in sticking with those weapons, but you'd probably be better off with sword specialization since it can still proc off of itself. i'd be happy to share my dagger builds with you if you like, or offer input on a sword or mace build.
     
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  8. ^9ine

    ^9ine Peasant

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    There are alot of different ways to spec a rogue, and ive played every one of them, and from my experience i would have to say that 31 point sub is a tough way to go. Subtelty does have some very strong talents, but you seem to have skipped over the best ones ;p

    Preperation is a must if you are going to be going that far into the tree, and improved cheap shot is a very very nice talent to have if you are going to be using swords.

    If you are going to be using daggers, i would suggest investing more into assassination. Relentless Strikes and Lethality will give you a big boost in damage and an energy return on your finishing moves. I wont run a spec without at least 20 points in this tree, sword or dagger build.

    I have alot more i could say, but im late for AQ! Feel free to pick my brain if you want and ill do my best to help you avoid all the mistakes ive made.

    -Typhoid
    Orc Rogue
    Blackrock
     
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  9. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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  10. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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    this is very very important. a rogue without relentless strikes is like a warrior without tactical mastery, i'd go at least 17 assassination so you can pick up lethality/relentless. also, since you said your build is more pve oriented, you'd get more mileage per point if you put 5 in master of deception instead of camouflage.

    as a soloer, i wouldnt put less than 17 in assassination, and no more than 13 in subtlety
     
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  11. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    I guess I just don't get Relentless Strikes. In PvE you are fighting only one monster most of the time. Why would I waste 4 talent points on skills that add energy and combo points for using a finishing move that will most likely kill the monster? My plan of attack is a Critical Ambush, a few swings, a Gouge, a Critical Backstab followed by Evicerate. Since I have never played a rogue at high levels, I don't know how much damage this combo would do, but that is what is driving my thinking. Please enlighten me.
     
  12. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    Finishing move isn't what you think it is I believe. Most of the time you probably won't kill a mob with a finishing move unless you've been fighting it for days. Finishing move is just using up the combo points you've build up with your special attacks. It does do a lot more dmg depending on how many points you built up but often then not a regular special attack is a much better option (energy-wise). My friend's ambush/backstab rogue actually crit for more dmg than his evis crits (most of the time) and a 5-point finishing move takes a while to build up whereas backstab and sinister strikes could do almost as good but you can keep doing it and not wait around.
     
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  13. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    OK... here is my final modification. This build would allow me to use Daggers which I am intent on doing and you won't be changing my mind. It is well rounded providing good initial damage with Ambush while also reaping the benefits of Relentless Strikes and Lethality. I would also have a lot of +dodge and +crit for normal fighting while still allowing for the Gouge/Backstab combination for big damage. This looks like a very well rounded build and the right one for me. Thanks for all your input. It has really helped me decide. Please tell me what you think of this final build:

    http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info...500000003233050000500000000050050003000000000
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2006
  14. ^9ine

    ^9ine Peasant

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    That looks like a solid build, definetly picking out the best talents in each tree. Combat dagger is a nice way to level, and the extra crit makes up for alot when your gear is lacking.

    There are a few rogue mods you might like to try out also, StunWatch and EnergyWatch. The names pretty much say it all, they give you a yellow timer bar that counts down whenever you stun/gouge/sap. . and will bring up multiple bars if you have multiple stuns running. Energywatch counts off 2 second ticks, so you know what your next 20 energy will come. Both very helpfull, because rogues are definetly all about timing.
     
  15. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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  16. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    leggo my aoe :(
     
  17. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    I was just thinking about that. I didn't know much about it so its good to know its really useful.
     
  18. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    Build looks good. Blade flurry is more sword oriented but I've never seen dagger rogues use it so I can't really comment whether or not it's good for dagger. You might want to consider Dual Wield also since your off-hand attacks more often (or faster I should say) than your main hand. Just keep that in mind and play around with it.
     
  19. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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    like sweeping strikes, it transfers your attack to a second target. this includes eviscerate and backstab, although for backstab to transfer the target needs to have their back to you as well.
     
  20. Delphiki

    Delphiki MSC Friend

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    This is similar to my build Hardcore PvE dps and MoD so I can solo BRD and LBRS, (I use 2/3 SnD for raiding though instead of Evis)

    http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=ibe0oxZG0Ez0Vzxcom

    I started raiding with both Dal'Rend swords, and a mosh posh of SC/lvl58 blues and switched from 22/8/21 daggers becasue of my terrible luck getting ahold of a decent dagger...

    I was always at the top of raid dps...here are the nice pts..

    Malice 5% crit is a must have
    Leathality 30% boost in crit dmg, speaks for itself
    Ruthlessness + Relentless Strikes are also must have, the ability to add another combo pt AND have Energy returned to you is HUGE, so you can imeadiltly mash another SS and follow with another stun or Evis instead of waiting for another tick for Energy to come back to you...

    Imp Gouge lets you do wonderful things, sit and wait for 2 energy ticks, escape combat in PvP = restealth, get some distance on mobs ect, ect...

    Riposte 150% weapon dmg for 10 Energy and disarms your oponent - prolly the single most useful skill Solo wise, increase your surviablity/ dmg mitigation, cheap and easy dmg boost

    Dual Weild Spec 50% increase in off hand dmg + the to hit skill means your not going to miss many targets at or below your lvl and just gets better with +hit items....this is a huge dps boost espcially used with swords because they have a larger dmg range

    Blade Flurry - so you can AE also stackes with SnD used with AR and you can kill most anything solo
     
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