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recruiting and raid instances

Discussion in 'MSC Clan' started by Jakeman, Jan 10, 2006.

  1. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    Lurk suggested a recruiting effort since we have received some positive recognition from my bottomless bag post... he said we might look to doing our own 20-man raids.

    I am all for recruiting, but I wanted some feedback on the 20-man thing. Honestly, doing our own raid instances doesn't appeal to me. Stuff like the ZG coop is cool because we get raid loot while still keeping our "small guild" atmosphere... it is that atmosphere that I don't want to lose.

    On a more selfish note... as a guild leader I don't look forward to leading regular 5 hour 20-man raids... leading a raid group is a big responsibility and a pain in the rear. :eek:
     
  2. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Actually I think this sounds like a good idea. Most of the 20 man instances dont have to be done all at once and it shouldnt be as much of a pain as the 40 man. I think 20 should still be comparitively easy in trying to keep things simple. We would not have to have all that many more members than we do now. If all of our inactives were active 60's we may be able to do it with the same number of members we have now. I can definitely understand the pain in the rear comment though. Being a guild leader is much harder work than most people realize. I say we should try it but since a large part of the strain will be put on you Jake I think you should be the deciding factor. I will help in any way possible though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2006
  3. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    WARNING: One of Lurk's verbose posts incoming.

    Without a doubt J does a lot more than people realize. This website is a perfect example. I've visited some of the raid guilds' sites and most of them don't hold a candle to this one, especially considering that this site is not WoW exclusive. And I agree with you Jake about the small guild feel. I confess to being a little tempted by the recent recruiting efforts from Bellum Gero and Amicus Alliance, but in the end I just don't think I'd enjoy that environment as much.

    That said, what I was trying to get at was just what Cal pointed out, we're really not that far off even with our current member base. Maybe we'd need some recruiting for class balance, but not that much. The tricky part will be everyone finding the same block of time to participate in raiding, I know that a lot of us have RL priorities, which is understandable. I was thinking we'd do ZG in chunks anyway, something like 2-3 hours a night, 2 nights a week. We won't be able to clear it in that time at first, but once we learn the instance we could.

    As far as leading, one advantage of having the same group all the time is that once everyone learns the encounters the raids almost lead themselves, not to take anything away from the job J does leading our 5-man events (which is excellent). But we can blow through LBRS, DM, etc. with little difficulty, I suspect a core group of MSCers would be able to do the same to ZG (and AQ20) given time. And I'd be happy to help with leading, taking ML duties or whatever so that Jake doesn't have to do it all himself. Firemane likes being the girl in the back who just nukes and sheeps what she's told, but maybe Jaden would like to do that once in a while too.
     
  4. Chanta

    Chanta MSC Knight

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    I know I haven't been part of the guild for very long but if you want my input.

    I agree with Cal and think it's a good idea. I know it's hard to lead a 20-man raid, but I think it would be easier if you have all guildies. I really enjoy going to instances with guildies. I find it a little difficult to go on one when you don't know whose leading it. I know J, Cal, Firemane, Sentinel (I know you joined a different guild) would do a wonderful job.

    PS: I know I haven't been on much. If you need my help with anything, just let me know. I would be glad to help.
     
  5. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    We need to decide on this. Jake is this a yes or no from you, we never really got any feedback? We arent getting responses from everyone either, seriously as a guild you need to give us some feedback people (I'm pretty sure we have more people than just Chanta). I dont want to waste my time if none of you are even remotely interested. In order to make this work we will have to actively recruit and help people really level to get this going anytime soon. I recognize the fact that we are a casual guild but things have turned pretty extreme. Ill send emails out tomorrow on this issue-to those of us that choose not to use the forums.
     
  6. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    I think recruiting enough people to be able to do 20-man raids is a good idea. Jaden doesn't always have to lead (even though he totally rocks!). After a run or two, other people can start to lead. I don't think we need very many more people in order to do this. We can probably get 10 people together as of right now if we really tried. Anyway, I say lets do it.
     
  7. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    Extreme changes?
    Everything seems the same as it has always been. I don't see any recent "extreme" changes, as Cal put it.

    Recruiting
    That is a "yes" to recruiting.

    20-man
    That is a "maybe" to the 20-man raid instances. We are far away from doing our own 20-man raids.

    People have lives. We currently have 12 lvl 60s (accounting for multiple 60s on the same account) yet we have trouble filling our own 5-mans sometimes. To organize a 20-man raid of casual gamers is no easy task. You either need to go hardcore on the softies or get a huge pool of softies, two things which require changes to the charter.

    I am looking forward to ZG coop and 5-man winged instances in the expansion, two things which are compatible with our current guild.
     
  8. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    I feel like the guild has turned to being more stationary. We used to have runs scheduled almost weekly. I dont want to beat a dead horse though, I've expressed this before. Not really the major issue at hand either so I'll drop this part.
     
  9. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    :scratchh:

    So where does that leave us? Are Cal and I to spearhead the recruiting efforts? I don't mind doing that but I didn't feel it was my place since I'm not the leader, nor do I have /ginvite powers, nor am I requesting them. Also, if I were going to recruit I would want to be doing so with the express goal of providing MSC with the capability of doing ZG and AQ20, even if it's only once in a while, without excessive dependence on other guilds. (Frankly I'm not holding my breath for the ZG coop at this point.) I gather J would consider such an effort contradictory to the current charter. Point being, if that's not our goal then I'm not the best choice to lead the effort.

    I'm not looking to go hardcore on anyone. I've missed some of my own runs due to RL events, so I know what that's about. I'm just getting burned out and want to see other content, and I doubt I'm the only one who feels that way. Would some of our less active 60s be more active if we had more to do in game as a guild? Maybe, maybe not. I don't want to speak for them, but the question is worth asking IMO.
     
  10. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I seem to be the only one not in favor, so it looks like we will go ahead and do this.

    A question this forces is... what about the ZG coop?

    That's because people don't need anymore the kinds of instances we run. We let people request what they need and try to make it happen.
     
  11. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Remind me what the last communication from AA was. Have we gotten anything definitive from them?
     
  12. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    Last communication said the runs have been pushed back to late January / early February.
     
  13. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    If you guys are bored I'm sure I can find something for you to help me with. :D
     
  14. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Maybe we should wait for word from the coop first. It's not that long of a wait. Not sure how everyone else feels about it. I would like to see us able to run our own 20 mans at some point though. I dont think it is to much to ask, we dont have to be on a regular schedule. We could just try and schedule them sometimes like we do normal instances now.

    Just curious, why are you against it Jake?
     
  15. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    Because it requires a big member base or a hardcore member base, and things big and hard scare me.

    But seriously... I don't like raid guilds. That's why.
     
  16. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Too much potential for drama? Honestly I was hoping for 10-20 more players like we already have. Cool folks with lives.

    I don't want MSC to become the next Casual, if I did I would apply to them. I like our existing policies: no mandatory attendance, no pressure on anyone to participate or not, no dictating playstyles or specs, etc. ZG and/or AQ20 one prescheduled weekend a month would satisfy me, not sure how others feel.

    Obviously you are uncomfortable with this idea Jake, and since MSC wouldn't even exist if not for you, your opinion should carry the most weight. No one here has a problem with that.

    I agree with Cal, why don't we table this for a few weeks and see what comes of the ZG coop? Or split the difference and open a general recruitment. If we get enough to do ZG so be it. If not, so be that too. I'm not trying to be a hard-liner here.
     
  17. Alteren

    Alteren MSC Knight and Donator

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    I don't really think i deserve a lot of sway in this matter as I'm a pretty new member, but I'll give you guys some of my thoughts on this :-).

    First of all, I've been playing my little gnome warlock again lately. If you need a big, bad, human tank and you see that little gnome on instead, just say the word :-)

    I was in Bellum Gero for a short time before I joined you guys. The buddies I had from the Rebels, guys I've known almost since I've started playing, had gone there. I don't know if, and doubt, Bellum is representative of all guilds that can do ZG one or two times a week, but I really hated the environment. There was a lot of drama, and it got to a point where it just wasn't fun any more.

    My buddies are all now in Scarlet Menace. For a lot of reasons, that's a move I just couldn't make (outside of the fact that no large guild needs warriors :-)).

    Anyway, I'm glad I didn't take that opportunity. You guys are great, and MSC has a really great atmosphere. I'm probably not the best player you have all ever palyed with, but you guys are the best I've played with. I've never had DM runs go so well, and I've never been in a gropu that stood a chance of taking down the king so smoothly or making the recovery that we did to save a wipe. Our 7 man LBRS run went 10x more smoothly than 99% of the 10-man runs I've been in.

    I guess I'm saying I enjoy playing with you guys, and I really don't want to lose the atmosphere we have now. It's not fully my decision though, and I'll stay with you guys with however you decide to change or not change this guild.

    I guess I'm saying that we should do our best to maintain the good atmosphere no matter what happens.
     
  18. JollyRedGiant

    JollyRedGiant MSC Commander

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    i honestly would like to be able to do guild runs to some of the 10 to 20 man instances. that said, i dont want MSC to turn into a raid guild. i know this is what other guys are saying also, but i do think that if a middle ground between our current guild and a small raid guild ( i guess) than i would be happy. the main thing is that MSC should stay very similar to the way it is now, and if that has to change to be able to do larger guild runs than i dont think that it is worth changing the guild over.
     
  19. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Guys we arent trying to turn this into a raid guild. All we want to do is to obtain a few more members so we can run some places we dont normally get to see. There would be no mandatory attendance or anything like that, loot is strictly need/greed using /random. There would be no difference that I can see except we have a few more members. Heck, this doesnt even need to be a weekly thing, it could be monthly. I for one just want to see some new places. Thats it.

    Alteren, even though you are new you have just as much sway here as anyone. Except for maybe Jaden, he holds final say in these matters. I for one respect what everyone has to say equally and your feedback was excellent. Thank you.
     
  20. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I will send mail to Antimilker to get an update on the coop ZG.
     

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