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Overview of Round 4 ships (Long)

Discussion in 'Planetarion' started by olon97, May 14, 2001.

  1. olon97

    olon97 Peasant

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    Please refer to the Tactitus Unit Tables to do your own evaluations of the ship types.

    Ok, I'm going to go over the whole list, sorting by travel time. Don't underrate travel time as sometimes an "ok" ship that gets to the battle on time is better than a "great" ship that arrives too late to help.

    ETA 2 ships (ETA 3 in Galaxy, ETA 4-8 in Parallel, ETA 6-10 in universe):
    • Spider (Fighter class)- THE defensive ship of round 4. Resources spent on spiders are NEVER wasted, in my opinion. (5/5 stars)

      On Defense: most effective ship at stopping astropods, nothing has early enough initiative to stop them from completing this task. Can be distracted by the wraith and phoenix, but in sufficient numbers it will shut down those units as well. Also freezes interceptors if all Corvette class ships have been taken care of (big whop).

      On offense: Much less useful. Occasionally worth bringing along if your attacking fleet has a lot of cruisers and destroyers (esp. Tarantulas) and you want to prevent the target's phoenix and wraiths from killing your big ships. Equally good flak as interceptors, but due to their importance on defense, I don't reccomend using spiders just for flak purposes.
    • Interceptor (Fighter class) - Arguably the worst ship of round 4. Has some situational use, and 0 crystal cost (so it doesn't keep you from buying spiders). Generally should be skipped once you have access to better ships. (1/5 stars)

      On Defense: Will kill astropods very inefficiently, but mobile enough that combined fleets of interceptors can make a noticeable dent. Every interceptor that dies means one more spider lives to fight another tick - therefore worthwhile.

      On Offense: May kill a couple wraiths/phoenix if you're lucky. Main use (if any) is to take the frig/Battleship fire so more valuable ships (Corvette class) will live longer. Slightly more efficient at killing spiders, but only if it gets around to targeting them (secondary)

    ETA 3 ships (ETA 4 in Galaxy, ETA 5-9 in Parallel, ETA 7-11 in universe):
    • Wraith (corvette class)- cloaking and higher initiative don't make up for the poor EMP resistance. Uses crystal which could have been spent on spiders.(3/5 stars)

      On Defense: Cloaking is a liability on defense - you WANT sector scans to show that you have large numbers of ships. Primary targets (ghosts and devastators) aren't worth killing compared to the secondary cruiser class ships.

      On Offense: Cloaking may lure the defender into not having enough spiders to stop all of your phoenix/wraiths/astropods combined. On the other hand, the poor EMP resistance means you have to send almost twice as many wraiths as you would have had to send phoenix to distract similar amounts of spiders from your astropods.
    • Phoenix (corvette class)- provides superb armor for Astropods and in sufficient numbers if unfrozen will tear into the valuable cruiser class (esp. tarants). (4.5/5 stars)

      On Defense: Not much point in protecting astropods on defense. On the other hand, there's not much harm in sending them and letting them do their inefficient job of killing. Phoenix will shine, however, if there are cruisers or tarantulas to kill - although the late initiative means the benefit may not be noticed until the following tick.

      On offense: Doesn't kill much, but boy does it provide great cover for astropods from PDS, and to a lesser extent spiders. If you have 2 phoenix to every 1 astropod, and outnumber the defender's spiders, you may get a few kills just for the fun of it. When roiding - not reducing your target's score by much may actually be a good thing (keeps you at maximum asteroid capture rate for longer).

    ETA 4 ships (ETA 5 in Galaxy, ETA 6-10 in Parallel, ETA 8-12 in universe):
    • Black Widow (Frigate Class)- Very cheaply removes two of the most deadly ship classes from combat, main weakness is its own vulnerability to EMP, which can be overcome by escorting with Warfrigates. When the Black Widow has no primary or secondary targets to fire at, it sits around useless. (4/5 stars)

      On Defense: Stops dreadnaughts, specters, and cruisers (but not tarantulas). 'Nuff said. Only problem is, those ships aren't likely to be in many attack fleets. When they are, however, you will be very grateful for any Black Widows you can find. Having lots of phoenix around to kill tarantulas will make black widows even more effective on the 2nd and 3rd ticks of combat.

      On offense: If your target has Battleships defending him, it will be very worth while to send Black Widows along to keep the Dreadnaughts and Specters from tearing into your astropods (and other corvette class ships).
    • Ghost (Destroyer Class)- attacks battleships and cruisers, but does so MUCH less efficiently than Black Widows. When firing randomly (i.e. no Destroyers or Cruisers around), does a piss poor job of killing things. The low initiative and cloaking might give the ghost a slight edge over the devastator, but neither ship is particularly useful. (2.5/5 stars)

      On Defense: well, IF it doesn't get frozen by tarantulas, and IF there are BAs or CRs to shoot at, at least it will generate salvage.

      On Offense: May be appropriate for "kill/punishment" fleets. Not a good general choice for a roiding fleet however.
    • Devastator (Destroyer class)- same as ghost except for a little more EMP resistance, more armor, more gun power, and less initiative (only makes a difference in fights against Dreadnaughts). Possibly the 2nd best choice after unfrozen phoenix at taking out Tarantulas. (2.5/5 stars)

      On Defense: Might as well use 'em if you've got 'em. Generates tasty salvage if you outnumber tarantulas, but chances are the tarants will freeze most Devastators before they fire.

      On Offense: Punishment fleets only. Even then, tons of Phoenix will probably do the job better.
    • War frigate (frigate class) - Ruled the skies in round 3. A decent low-ETA place to spend metal leaving plenty of crystal to buy spiders. A "tank with a pea shooter" whose only real enemy (and ironically best use) is the hyperion turret. (3.5/5 stars)

      On Defense - Enough War Frigates combined in defending a planet can provide a nice sting to an attacker that won't be forgotten. Easier to get them to the defender on time because of low ETA. Attacks fighters then corvettes, both of which go down reasonably easy and are generally high priority targets strategically (with the exception of interceptors). Also provides good EMP cover for your black widows (fewer widows frozen by enemy tarants - more enemy BAs frozen by your widows).

      On offense - kills spiders without slowing down your roiding fleet, you'd get more astropods through if you just sent more phoenix most likely. If the target has hyperion turrets, you should always send enough frigates to take all the hyperion fire all 3 ticks (because hyperions kill corvettes with brutal efficiency if allowed to target their secondary targets). Also, if you're sending black widows to freeze the opponent's BA class ships, then having frigs to make sure that the defender's tarantulas don't take out all the Black Widows may be wise.
    • Astro Pods (corvette class)- Build these, steal asteroids, say no more. Just be sure that all your combined corvette class stuff can get by your target's spiders when attacking. (5/5 stars)

      On Defense - you're kidding right?

      On Offense - no attack is complete without astropods. Even a "punishment fleet" should have them since taking someone's roids is a great punishment.
     
  2. olon97

    olon97 Peasant

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    ... (continued - max character limit reached)

    ETA 5 ships AKA SLOW SHIPS (ETA 6 in Galaxy, ETA 7-11 in Parallel, ETA 9-13 in universe):
    • Tarantula (Cruiser class)- Freezes Destroyer and frigate class ships before they ever get a chance to fire. Will get raped by phoenix if not sufficiently protected by spiders. (4/5 stars)

      On Defense - The attacker's pods threaten your roids, so your Battleship class ships threaten the pods, but the attacker sent black widows to freeze your Battleships - but boom! your tarants freeze the black widows first, the battleships fire, the pods die, and you win. Got that? ;) (note this doesn't work as well if you're missing your fundamentals - lots o spiders to disable the phoenix).

      On offense - substitute "spider" for "astropod" in the story above, and you get the same deal. Only problem is, you've slowed down your fleet by 1 tick, giving the target more time to find defense. If you're sending a kill/punishment fleet - having tarantulas along is a good idea.
    • Specter (battleship class)- Rips up astropods and spiders with better resource efficiency than the PDS designed for the same purpose. More easily frozen by black widows than the Dreadnaught, but on the other hand, packs a real nasty surprise for anyone who didn't bother to mil scan you. (4/5 stars)

      On Defense - due to the "slow" factor, mainly useful in-galaxy for stopping astropod attacks, or one tick late if sent in-parallel (at best). Really makes the enemy pay for their visit if they didn't send enough black widows to cover the Specters. Competes with spiders for precious crystal - making them not the best choice if spider coverage was insufficient to freeze the pods (takes 5.5 times as much resources on Specters to deal with pods as effectively as spiders do).

      On Offense - Cloaking makes this an ideal "kill fleet" ship for targets that don't have black widows on hand and don't bother to get a military scan done. With spiders as a primary target, a big Specter attack can leave the defending planet without effective astropod defense for a long time to come if they don't have enough crystal income to rapidly buy replacements. For regular roiding, the specter is a bit slow and may reduce the target's score too much (if there is such a thing - depends on how close you are to the limits for maximum roid capture).
    • Dreadnaught (Battleship class)- Also kills fighter and corvette classes very efficiently, but only gets frozen half as often as Specters by Black widows. Combined with a friendly science player's tarantulas - Dreadnaughts can be the key part of a very effective combo. (4.5/5 stars)

      On Defense - most of the same points as for Specters, except the more plentiful metal is the main resource required to build these ships (leaving you plenty of crystal for spiders).

      On Offense - they will see you coming, but if you're using Dreadnaughts in a kill fleet, then hopefully the defender won't be able to do much about it. They will have to spend more resources on Black Widows than if they only had to prepare for the same number of Specters (ignoring tarantulas). With a friend's tarantula's along side, Dreadnaughts may turn out to spell unstoppable death for your enemies (unless you're attacking someone bigger than you of course).
    • Star Cruiser (Cruiser Class) - If you have a grudge against frigate class ships (i.e. want to destroy them not freeze them) and you can't lure them to your own planet (where hyperions would kill frigs more efficiently), then the Star Cruiser is pretty much your only option. Much like the tarantula, a spider escort may be required to protect the Star Cruiser from the mobs of phoenix in the universe. Probably better to just let the poor frigs be and focus on killing corvettes/spiders which will almost always be around to kill. (3.5/5 stars)

      On Defense - you're more likely to have plenty of spiders along for the ride, and can pick your battles. Good for killing those pesky black widows that are freezing your dreadnaughts. The slight loss of killing efficiency compared to hyperions is made up for somewhat by the extra mobility.

      On Offense - For kill fleets, when those Black widows and war frigates "must die". Probably a bad choice generally for roiding fleets, but if you're sending Dreadnaughts anyway, and can't talk a friend into sending Tarantulas to back you up - you may want to bring some cruisers along.


    phew... done!
     
  3. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    omg, 12,215 characters total between those two posts. hehe. The default max character limit per post for vB is 1,000. I set it to 10,000 thinking that no one would ever hit that. I was wrong. :D

    Should I up the limit past 10,000?

    btw, peeps in the private forum are wondering where you ran off to. We're all lost without your guidance and wisdom. :p
     
  4. olon97

    olon97 Peasant

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    Nah, the word limit is probably fine. Took me a long time to write that post and I doubt I'll pass that mark again soon. :yawn:

    I've been meaning to get back to the private forums. Auto gave me the link to all the balance changes in the expansion, and I must say it has really excited me about the chances of playing non-hammerdin paladins again.

    My disappearance was due to Baldur's Gate and then early round PA addiction. Right now I'm working full time producing just under 100 asteroids per day for my galaxy mates at around 12k M per roid and handling the tricky business of parallel alliance politics (basically Auto and I are in a parallel already locked up by some of the biggest alliances in the game - ugh!).

    That said... ye ole coriander proclaims: "I shall return!" :cool:
     
  5. mud

    mud Peasant

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    Interceptors are smewhat useful this round, compared ot last round.

    This round they are twice as strong, and the fastest firing weapon, besides EMP, only has a 25% chance to be hit. It doesnt kill much, but at least they arnt worth less, I would give them 2/5 stars.

    Wraiths are the only ship that targets the destroyer class ships, now only if they are worth shooting at.

    SC might last longer then you think against phoinexs, with its 200 armor it can take a beating. However it takes 4 of them to kill 1 WF, or 3.2 per BW. Im going to war route because the SC is the ONLY ship that targets WF for destruction.

    Dreadnaughts and Spectres will be great defense. Spectres can be frozen by 5 BW, but they can kill 5 pods a tick. It takes 10 BW to frezze a Dreadnaught.

    Ghost, hmm, a cloaked Devastator with poorer stats. Lets see here, it takes 27 of them to kill 1 Dreadnaught. there is enough meta and crystal to build 3 DN with the ghost resources. and it only takes 2 DN to kill 1 ghosts. so for less resources the DN can do more

    And with spectres you get 5 of them. so you kill 2 ghosts.

    PDS:

    Meson: Cheap CO killing power. It only takes 17 of them to kill a pod. and at 350 of each it is affordable.

    Hyperion: 1k of each, targets Friggs, does decent damage.

    the next 2 are a waste.

    Then we have Ion :). Lets see here, has piss ass poor shot speed, and couldn't ever hit an interceptor. BUT if it did, hehe. targets BA class and does a whopping 75 damage, it can kill alot if oyu have enough, but someone first has to attack you with BA's for it to be useful. but 75 damage :). Also has a good 250 Armor, thus it is no easy target to kill. but is still a waste of resources.

    The only one you will ever need is meson.
     
  6. olon97

    olon97 Peasant

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    Good points Mud. I was a little harsh on that arbitrary star rating for the interceptor, and Star Cruisers probably should have a better rating than frigs.

    Yeah, ION turrets suck. That's one point everyone who has looked at the numbers agrees upon. :p

    Good ship building strategy is more about how you put your fleet together, not just having lots of the "best" ships. A lot will also depend on what the "average" fleet starts to look like, because a fleet designed to defeat the average fleet will then become a good fleet, even if that custom fleet does poorly against rarer fleets.

    I actually wrote another long review of PDS for my galaxy mates, but pretty much came to the same conclusions as Mud: lots of Mesons, possibly Hyperions as well. Only build the later PDS if you expect regular visits from their primary/secondary target types, but nomatter what don't build (or even research for that matter - at least until you've done everything else) ION turrets.
     
  7. mud

    mud Peasant

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    Im going to build 1 ion turret, jsut for the hell of it :)

    Spectres and Dreadnaughts are still too slow to attack, unless its in paralelle, but i would advise against that. We got attacked recently by an x15a member. we arnt a member soooo.. . . it works too our dis advantage. But on the bright side some of my galaxye mates are research and build the factoryies for Spectres and DN so they will be handy for that.
     

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