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i think i am depressed

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Jakeman, Sep 19, 2006.

  1. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    A long relationship ended very badly about 4 months ago, and in that time I have not improved at all. I have this constant sinking feeling and I get nauseous in the presence of women and/or alcohol. I can still function but I always feel like shit.

    "Time" doesn't seem to be helping. Are any experienced people here able to suggest something else that might help?
     
  2. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Ouch. Been there. (Still am there somewhat.) Getting too late to adequately reply to this, but will post more tomorrow. Suffice it to say that I feel for you. Just try to remember that not all women are the same, even though it sure seems that way some days.
     
  3. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Ok, keeping in mind that Dr. Phil I am not...

    I know some of the details of your breakup from chats we had about it at the time. Without getting into the specifics here, I can say two things with 100% confidence, based on what I do know:

    1. You did the right thing.
    2. She was definitely an exception, not the rule, when it comes to females.

    It's only natural to have trepidation about putting yourself out there again after you've been hurt, and four months is not as long as you think when it comes to getting completely over that. You need to regain trust, not only in new women, but also in yourself. It sounds to me like you may be beating yourself up a little bit for making a bad choice in women. If so, stop it. Even bad relationships are learning experiences, you now know some of the things to watch out for in the future and have a better idea of what you do want.

    Something else to keep in mind: you're never going to like everything about the person you are with, nor will they like everything about you. Expecting otherwise is unrealistic and undermining. What you have to decide is, what is a deal breaker? What habits, quirks, whatever, will you not be able to tolerate no matter how perfect she is otherwise? For you, it sounds like alcohol may be a deal breaker. That's perfectly fine, and understandable. Believe it or not, there are women in their early 20s who don't drink, or if they do are able to do so in moderation. If women who drink are a problem for you, find ones who don't. Maybe that sounds easier than it is, but there are plenty of ways to meet women nowadays. And if alcohol, or anything else, is a deal breaker, make sure that's known to her sooner rather than later. You don't want to go too far down the path of knowing and liking someone only to find out there's an "elephant in the room" that you haven't talked about. Likewise you should find out what is a deal breaker for her, and have the courage to be honest with her if you find out that you have a habit or quality that she may not be able to abide. Note that none of these "deal breakers" makes either you or her a bad person, just incompatible with each other.

    Anyway, making a long story short, my advice: push through it. Force yourself to get out there and talk to women. But make it easier on yourself by doing it with no expectations one way or the other. It's just two people talking, "Hi how are you? What do you do? blah blah blah, etc." Most of the encounters will go no further, and that's okay. What you're doing is building trust and confidence again. Sooner or later you're bound to run into someone that sparks your interest, and you'll be surprised at how fast that nauseous feeling turns into butterflies in the stomach because you're excited to talk to her again.

    Finally, if you find you just cannot get out of the rut, there's no shame in seeking professional advice.

    Long post, I hope it helps.
     
  4. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I tried that at my high school choral reunion last weekend. I ended up skipping the concert because I felt too ****ed up from all of the interaction during the day.

    Professionals just put you on antidepressants to alter your perception of reality. I have a strong aversion to that kind of escape as well as to long term meds in general.

    <vent>
    The hardest part about this is that I still have feelings for her, but all she can do is rub salt in my wounds by dumping her own wants and needs on me when she calls... I need you, I want you, I wish you were here. **** that. What about me? I gave you everything, including my ability to trust. It is totally inappropriate and offensive for you to request more at this point. It burns like no other to care for some one who continually hurts you. I haven't heard from her in a while now. I think I have finally been demoted to just another life problem that she can't fix... that was my job.
    </vent>
     
  5. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    Disclaimer: The following statement is simply a theory and has not been tested or studied by any medical professionals. Its is drawn from a compilation of observed situations and personal experiences. Please seek a second opinion before starting this regiment. Side effects may include headache, nausia, upset stomach, runny nose and diarrhea. If you start having have thoughts of suicide or other harmful activities, please stop immediately and call your doctor.

    ---------------------------------

    I've had my share of women that I couldn't get out of my head for one reason or another. Whether its a bad breakup or something less severe, the root of the problem is that you can't get this woman and everything you've done together out of you head. Everything you look at reminds you of her and you try hard not to think about her which just makes it worse. You can't just supress all your feelings and pretend it never happened. Although that seems like the only way to get over her, that will just drive you insane. I think that by trying to fight your feelings, its making you physically sick.

    Now, I rarely suggest listening to women when it comes to advice or important decisions because they think more with their hearts and not their minds. Men do things because to them it is the most logical, calculated move whereas women follow their "instincts" and passion. But in this case, the case of love, women think on a much higher level than men. And women have been dealing with getting their hearts broken for much longer, and much more often than we have. It's an unfortunate truth that plagues us "nice guys" out there.

    So finally, here's my advice. Do what women do to get over a bad breakup. Take a few days and just let it all out. Turn on those sappy love songs or those tear-jerker "chick flicks" that make you think of her. Hold those items around your place that have some sentimental meaning and just let it out. Eat a tub of ice cream, I don't care. And by let it out, yes... i do mean... *gasp*... cry. Its okay man, no one will see you.

    See, girls get over boyfriends like you get a song out of your head. You listen to the song over and over and over again until you are just sick of it. Girls go on emotional overload for two or three days until there are no more tears to cry, and then, like magic, they begin to feel better and move on.

    I think you are feeling bad because you are holding it in and trying to distract yourself from thinking about her rather than comfronting your feelings. I know its hard for guys to do, but you really need to turn your mind off for a few days and just do what feels good. Writing on the forums was a good first step towards letting your feelings out. I know what its like to feel depressed and how good it feels to just tell someone about it.

    I hope that some of what I said makes any sense to you and helps you in some small way. Feel better man.
     
  6. harleyb

    harleyb Peasant

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    Why do women and alcohol make you nauseous? Sorry, you just haven't given us much to go off of, except for people "in the know" like Lurk.
     
  7. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I couldn't do that even if I wanted to... I honestly don't know how.

    Bad memories.
     
  8. dcwilson26

    dcwilson26 MSC Knight

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    Wow...
     
  9. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Ok, who let Tom Cruise in here? (j/k)

    From what I understand, antidepressants are not generally the first course of treatment, except maybe by "carpet bombing" physicians who aren't specialized to treat mood disorders. I also have an aversion to meds, to the point that I won't even take Advil unless I have a raging headache. That said, depression should not be your natural state. If it is, I would suggest that your perception of reality is already altered.

    But anyway, I wasn't saying that you need medication. What I was suggesting was a counselor or therapist that you can talk to to get some of these things out in the open, and who can give you better answers than we are perhaps qualified to do here. When I read that you get ****ed up even just interacting with regular people, that makes me wonder if there's not a more deep seeded issue than just this girl. Talking to a complete stranger is not the easiest thing in the world to do (trust me I know), but a dispassionate evaluation can be a good thing.

    But, maybe it's not as deep as all that. Maybe you just need to spend some time with people you already trust: friends, family, etc. Immerse yourself in things that you enjoy (not just WoW, btw), and do some living for good ol' number 1.

    This is why it is taking you months to get over it. Breakups need to be clean. If she's still been calling you saying things like that, then like you said, she's just keeping the wound open. In truth, then, you haven't really had four months to heal, so I'm not surprised you're still feeling the pain. She needs to be completely out of your life, for at least a while. That doesn't mean you don't or won't still have feelings for her, just that you need time to put them in perspective and move on with your life.

    It's a good thing that she is no longer calling you. See it as a blessing in disguise. Don't attempt to contact her yourself, no matter how much you may want to. You probably know by now that you cannot be friends with her. It just doesn't work. Maybe after much time has passed and you've both moved on, then it's possible to be "arm's length" friends, but it sounds like you are nowhere near that at this point.

    For what it's worth, I respectfully disagree with dc. Holding on to the things that remind you of her is unhealthy. I'd suggest the complete opposite actually, throw away the pictures, letters, cards, whatever you have. Burn them, rip them up, put them in the shredder. Do it tonight. Do it now. Not out of spite towards her, don't get me wrong. Do it out of the desire not to be stuck in this rut anymore. I guarantee you you will start to feel better the instant you do it. People don't heal when they're in that grief period where all they can do is cry about what they've lost, they start to heal when they finally get sick of feeling shitty and make the first step toward the rest of their lives.
     
  10. MisterHalleck

    MisterHalleck Peasant

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    Jake's thoughts on antidepressants echo my own. My mom, on the other hand, believes that they are just like heart medication or vitamins for old people - you need them because you can't function without them. Uh, thanks but no thanks, I'll keep MY reality.

    The thing with counselors/therapists/shrinks in general, is that they are NOT going to take your side. The stance of the shrink will always be, you are there because you have personal problems, stuff you need to change about yourself.

    Heh, I agree with DCWilson's proposal to indulge after a breakup, but not indulge in things that remind you of the one you miss. I also agree with Jake... I have (in my own perception) hideously bad memories of things that happen when women and alcohol are mixed (and lack of women plus alcohol).

    The best way, I think... you have to find a way to convince yourself that you were just as well off in the times you weren't with her. From the sound of it, you've stayed in contact as pseudo-friends since the breakup, and that's not healthy unless you are very very very confident in your status. If you unload your anxieties on her, tell her what's eating you, it will either convince her to come back, or permanently sever the relationship in a way that you will be happier with than the limbo you seem to be in.
     
  11. BaleFire

    BaleFire MSC Footman

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    I think that is part of the problem. Maybe dc's way is hard for you. Maybe you don't cry. But confronting/expressing/dealing with your emotions with some sort of semi-symbolic act is often helpful. The specific method isn't really the important part.

    Maybe dc cries over a picture of her while listening to the song that was playing when he first met her, accepting that he's no longer with her.

    Maybe lurk burns the picture and deletes the song from his iTunes library, pushing the relationship into the past and not worrying about it 'cause it's done and there's no point in staying sad.

    If it were me, I'd probably write some really bad poetry about how I felt.

    Maybe you pour it all out to your best friend. Or to a shrink. Or in a journal that you'll never show anyone else.

    Maybe you run 3 miles at 5 in the morning, then climb up onto the roof of your house and think about things while the sun rises.

    All that said, if you get out your tub of ice cream and your teddy bear and say to your self, "This isn't going to help," it won't. You have to say "I'm going to express my emotions abstractly through fingerpaints until I feel a little better," and you have to believe it. You don't need to get all better, just a little better. You don't have to cure yourself in one go. Maybe you don't even feel better, but you have a greater understanding of exactly what you feel and why you feel it. Even that is worthwhile.

    And on psychiatrist subject, my understanding of the way that it's supposed to work is that they give you meds if you have a medical condition that causes a chemical imbalence in your brain that makes you sad. If you're sad because you just had a nasty breakup, they talk to you and try and get you to figure out what your feeling, and what you can do about it.
     
  12. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Well of course it's not quite THAT easy. But yeah, that's the general idea, at least for me. My mage is the only thing left that remotely reminds me of my ex, and of course I couldn't just delete her now that she's all geared up. ;)

    Anyway, well said Bale. Kudos.
     
  13. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I am the counselor. People talk to me about their problems, not the other way around. I feel very strongly that I understand all aspects of this situation, including my own flaws and mistakes, and I honestly do not think a counselor would be able to help me. People use counselors for dumping, but that mechanism doesn't work for me. I internalize everything and confront it full on. I don't let go of anything, even the bad stuff. I need my angst because it keeps me sharp and in control. I don't want to pretend that everything is OK because it isn't. For these reasons, any suggestions involving "letting go" or "unloading" or "forgetting" won't work for me. Nor can I indulge myself anymore than I already have. I just feel overloaded right now. I am looking for some way to better manage all of this garbage.

    @Halleck
    She has stayed in contact, but I have not. We are anything but friends right now. I told her everything that is eating me and she is either unwilling or unable to fix those problems, yet she persists. I think she is better at ignoring stuff than I am.
     
  14. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Dude, carrying your baggage around with you is not the answer. You claim to be overloaded but instead of looking for ways to get that weight off of your shoulders, you're asking for a bigger bag to carry it in. Wrong answer.

    It's not pretending things are OK. It's not even forgetting. It's about dealing with your issues so that you can actually be OK.

    Internalizing != confronting. Internalizing = avoiding.

    What you call "sharp and in control" I call cynical and distant. If you want to go around the rest of your life mistrusting everyone you meet, that's your choice. Sounds like a pretty crappy way to live to me.

    You're a very logical person. Did it ever occur to you that the reason you are not improving is because you are taking the exact wrong approach?

    I'm not trying to flame you man. I'm just telling you that hanging on to your hurt is not the right way to deal with things. It's only going to get worse for you if you persist.
     
  15. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I have confronted everything fully. Where other guys would have blown up and attacked or ignored the girl, I have kept an open mind and talked about my problems with her and some select friends. There is a big difference between internalizing and burying. I confront my problems within, whereas others leave them on the street or give them to some one else.
     
  16. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    Fair enough. I believe very strongly that you need to find a way to let go of your bad feelings though. For me that's a matter of learning my lessons, and then severing the ties with what's past and moving forward. I'm not saying it happens overnight, but by conciously choosing to be OK, I soon find that I actually am OK. It's not pretending, it's a choice I make.

    Maybe you are trying and I'm just not getting that from your messages, it just seems to me that either through her actions or yours, or both, the wound remains open. Some things can never be rationalized or understood. Some things just are. I know you still care about her, and that's perfectly natural, but it's time to move on and let yourself begin the healing process.

    I know that sounds glib, but I don't know how else to say it. I apologize if my advice is inadequate.
     
  17. OsIriS

    OsIriS Peasant

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    The first thing you have to realize is that people, especially young people, make a lot of dumb mistakes this includes binge drinking, and on a few occassions major substance abuse -- I've seen more than one person descend into a K-hole from which there is almost no escape, leading to an attempt at suicide, or worse, succeeding. Most of the time, they don't know who they are yet and are latching on to things that make them feel better, however temporary. It could be a person, an activity, a substance. So try not to blame yourself or her for the dumb sh-- that went on.

    Another thing you have to realize is that when you are in your early 20's, you generally just don't have the experience nor the mechanisms in place to deal with a bad break-up (this doesn't change with age, by the way, so sorry about that in advance). Emotions aren't logical, so it's impossibe to logically analyze them, nor can you really control them.

    Men are not more logical than women, if anything, we are even sappier and sentimental than they are evidenced by the popular female saying, "the best way to get over a man is to get under another one -- I don't think, Jake, however, this approach would work for you.

    We all make mistakes. The only thing we can do is learn from them.

    Even the counselors need people to talk to. Sometimes a third party can provide a clarity, or an experience that you just don't have. Most of us on this board don't know you, or this, situation enough to provide that clarity. So I do suggest you find someone, a friend, who knows enough about this situation and who you love and trust enough to unload on them what's really going on. Because there's more going on inside of you than you are a, telling us, and b, are capable of expressing on an Internet message board.

    At some point, you've got to just say F it and get back in there. Oddly enough, that's how I met my wife. I was getting sick and tired of the nickel and dime dating game. I just said F it, and just said, I'm just going to make friends. I don't even care anymore. The next thing you know, I'm asking someone to marry me. And we've been married for almost 4 years now. You always find what you aren't looking for.

    Good luck, man. Bad break-ups are not fun.
     
  18. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    I had a hard time with social stuff before this happened. Now I feel ruined, as if I am physically unable to enjoy myself. I keep trying but it ain't workin for me yet.

    I didn't sleep well last night because I kept dreaming about all the shit that happened. Then I had another rough sleep walking episode, but I didn't make it outside this time so the skins weren't too bad.
     
  19. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Wow, you guys have been really busy lately. I have like 103 posts to read through, lol. Jake, I am a bit like you and been hurt by women before. I don't normally converse with others about some problems because it just makes me feel worse or more frustrated. While I always suggest talking to someone just for a more stable opinion, there are some things in life you just have to work out for yourself. If you are not getting any better though, it's probably because you are keeping in contact with this girl. She is leading you on and stringing out your emotions. I would just suggest cutting everything off with her and allow yourself time to heal. Then perhaps you can move on. This "sickness" you get around women and alcohol is probably due to the fact that everything is still fresh in your mind.

    I have found that in matters of love there is no "expert." There will be very few people that understand how you feel because we are all individuals with different levels of understanding and emotion. People can give you all the advice in the world and it won't help. We are all to different. Anyhow, as I said just cut contact and give it time. It may take 5 months or a year but it will go away eventually. In the meantime just don't allow your depression to get the better of you and end up doing something stupid.

    Hope to see you guys around soon but in the meantime, good luck. :)
     

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