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Discussion in 'Character Building' started by Haite, May 7, 2005.

  1. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

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    I've seen numbers from raid instances that show us (Hunters) doing the second highest damage over the course of a whole raid instance. For example, on a given outing in Molten Core, a Rogue might do about 1,300,000 damage over a section of the raid. Over the same section, a Hunter can get to around 1,200,000 depending on gear and mana use. Mages fall way behind to 800,000-900,000, because they're only good for burst damage - their mana pools run out in a minute or two on a ten minute fight. I can't seem to find the links I was looking at last night, but I'll try and dig them up later.
     
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  2. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

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  3. MisterHalleck

    MisterHalleck Peasant

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    I suppose that Priests probably do the lowest damage in raids/instance runs...

    I guess you could say we do damage by proxy by keeping you rogues and mages alive :p
     
  4. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    Definitely... DPS classes can't do their work without healers.

    I can't speak for other classes, but mages really pump out the DPS when they AOE groups of mobs. Mages have the strongest AOE by far.
     
  5. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    There's one main reason why mages fall so far behind hunters in damage. That reason is that most high level instances are mainly fire-based. Fire is the most damaging spell a mage have and in these types of situation where mobs have high resists to fire, mages does reduced damage. All the really high level instances (Onyxia's Lair, MC, and soon Blackwing's Lair) are all fire-based. Arcane is consistant but have so-so dps(200-250 dps with AM) and frost is mainly defensive and rely on crits (about 140-175 dps without crits) so you can't be both defensive and offensive at the same time. Fire however, can do upwards to 1400 without crits (400-475 dps) and being in places with high fire-resist creeps, it gets reduced to about 200-300 dps.

    Hunters get a lot of their dps from stings/poisons same as rogue and in fire-based places of course they will out-damage a mage. I just hope that Blizz would release an elite instance where it's not fire-based, then mages would truely shine. The reason why the elite instances are fire-based is the fact that fire have always been the deadliest type in the game so they will probably not deviate from this. Although I do admit that hunters have pretty good damage output. I've been hit by 3-4 shots and died before in a TM raid and I have 2850 hp so I know how much hunters can do. I think Hunters rank 3rd in damage output overall behind Mages(2nd) and Rogues(1st), that is until the next patch.
     
  6. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    I have crit a mage for over 2000 damage in a raid before. Also, multi shot is another dangerous one I use on even single targets if I am trying to take them out real quick. It seems to crit a lot and I can hit three mobs for 800+ (sometimes 1,000) and it happens often with this ability for some reason. We arent as bad as people think, however we have a LOT of weaknesses as well. Upcoming patches are going to make us worse I fear, I could be wrong though. I think the reason that most instances are fire based is because mages are so uber it gives the other classes a chance to actually do something. In other words, it brings you down to normality, lol.
     
  7. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    Gotta consider that mages are basically naked = no armor. Have you tried it against a druid in bear form with 7k armor? I'd like to know what your damage is. For mages it doesn't really matter (unless you get resisted).

    Who said hunters were bad? When I started WoW, I rolled a hunter myself. It's just that they're like Pallys (way too many of them).

    Only fire mages can be uber. Other mages are just good or decent. My frost mage kinda sucks in raid, except for crowd control and keeping mobs from running and the occasional AoE. In 1v1 battle, most classes will own me. I'm spec'd for control/grinding/farming. Otherwise, I'm not much use when it comes to dmg, that's the rogue/hunter/warrior department in raids that I'm in. I'd like to respec back to fire/arcane so that I can compare to other dps classes.
     
  8. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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    On my last few molten core runs the top 10 damage dealers from zone entrance -> majordomo have been 7 warriors 2 rogues and 1 hunter. i'm constantly in the top 5 with 3 other warriors and a rogue... the hunter bounced between 9 and 10 the whole time. now keep in mind that we farm the hell out of molten core, and all of us are pretty decked out (all of the hunters have core marksman rifles, blastershot launcher, or striker's mark)

    i was pretty surprised at the results, since a lot of the monsters tend to run around.. and i miss attacks because i'm chasing them, while hunters continue firing uninterrupted.
     
  9. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Even against high armor mobs I can crit for 1500 maybe a little over. We get a dps advantage on arrows and bullets up to 50 I think but there it stops. I think we should get another damage boost on ammo at 60. Playing a hunter is fun but you are right, there are WAY to many of them.
     
  10. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

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    Well I was just pointing this out to boost Hunter morale. We feel our class gets trashed a lot, but assuming we've hit rock bottom, we do have things to look forward to. Pets are going to become a lot better in either the next patch or the one after, and our talents are going to be finished (finally). Maybe we'll be useful and desirable in the coming weeks.
     
  11. Autolycus

    Autolycus Forum Moderator

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    I ran the parser again tonight when we killed ragnaros. at the end of the fight the top 5 were: warrior (me) , hunter, rogue, rogue, warrior. For the basic molten core clears, hunters are infinitely more useful than rogues because most of the mobs have some kind of AE damage, either physical or fire based... and the rogues end up soaking up a lot of heals that should go to tanks.
     
  12. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    Ran a small raid tonight with Ertai and in the end I cam up 5th or 6th in a group of 10 with like 3 pallies , a warrior, a rogue, and 2 mages ( i think we had a priest and maybe two druids- not sure). I also noticed that on the bosses where i could really release all my damage I was putting out more than all of them except maybe one of the mages. When i put everything I have though my mana goes down very quickly so its not really ideal in group mob situations. Thanks for the boost Haite, I have needed it of late. Feeling a bit better about the class now though so I shouldnt complain as much. ha ha ha.
     
  13. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    I was the only mage there. Other was a warlock. I came in 2nd but then again my mage is only good for AoE. I don't put out enough dmg for duels but I like control. Reason my favorite color in MTG is blue (Control). Red is next since it's pure dmg. I'll respec to Fire once I get my epic mount (only 150g to go).

    Cal got 4th which is pretty good. Ranking was Rogue, Mage(me), Warlock, Hunter(Cal), Warrior, then rest.
     
  14. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

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    What exactly is your build, out of curiosity? Do you and Jake have similar builds?

    Sorry if you've answered this in another thread, I'm still playing catch up with this game. :D
     
  15. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    He has posted it like a million times. :p He is basically 31 frost, 20 arcane (I think).

    No, we do not have the same builds. I am 44 arcane, 7 frost.
     
  16. Scorpion

    Scorpion Peasant

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    My build is 33 Frost/18 Arcane. Not meant for duels since you need at least 21 in Arcane to duel properly (gotta have that PoM). No, my build is meant to farm/grind, whatever you want to call it. I'm specialized in AoE'ing mobs.
     
  17. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    This is what the Beaststalker set is supposed to look like after patch. What do you guys think? I cant decide if I like it any better or not.
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Jakeman

    Jakeman MSC Founder and Donator

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    That looks sweet.
     
  19. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

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    I think it blows. Even the old one looked better. Dwarves and Orcs love it because it looks good on their stumpy bodies - every other race hates it. Our elite sets look a thousand times better, and they're supposedly placeholder graphics. I read a good post on the Hunter forum that said Beaststalker should use the Dragonstalker placeholder graphic, because it looks very cool.
     
  20. Calendryll

    Calendryll MSC Commander and Donator

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    I dont know, I think it looks better than it does now. To many rainbow colors for me at this point. Right now it doesnt look like getting the complete set is feasible so I am going to make a mismatch outfit, ha ha. The beast stuff doesnt seem to drop often, Ive killed the guys who drop the different parts at least ten times with no luck so far. What I have of the set so far comes from random trash mobs. Some more DM runs and I would be set I think. Only problem is nobody runs DM much.
     

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