Portal   Forum   Members   Market   Gallery   Events

Are non-melee chars getting spanked in the X-pack?

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Lurk, May 9, 2001.

  1. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2000
    Messages:
    2,586
    Likes Received:
    47
    Market Rating:
    0
    I've been surfing around the various D2X forums, and apparently there is an entire movement of Sorceress and Necro players who are up in arms, claiming that they are getting screwed in the X-pack. Here are some of their points..

    1. Casting timers make fast cast items useless, and the damage increase for spells with timers is not enough to compensate for the delay. Apparently some people have done the calculations, and because of the delay the potential damage per second has been cut by somewhere around four times, even with the boosted damage. (I wonder if that's actually true. If so, it's a valid concern, since in reality Sorcs are being punished for lag on the servers, which is not their fault.)

    2. No gambling for uniques screws Necros, because they can't use magic find items with minions. (Actually, gambling questions aside I've always thought that was stupid. Minions should be treated as a use of a skill, just like any other.) Also screws sorcs since you still can't gamble for wands or staves, but melee chars and zons will still be able to gamble for good items. Necros and Sorcs tend to use certain uniques more, while the other chars make use of more rares.

    3. Increases to the Necro Poison skills are not enough to make them viable. Even at slvl 20, PN still only does something like 200 damage in 2 secs, well below what a melee char can potentially do. (Not sure where these numbers are coming from, I'm just reporting what these people are saying.)

    4. Charged items make the good Sorc and Necro skills available to all, rendering those chars useless. (This one is very debateable, although I am of the opinion that charged items should not be rechargeable. I like the idea of being able to sample other skills, but once they are gone, they should be gone.)

    So, what does everyone here think? My opinion is that there may be some valid points here, but on the whole it's a bunch of whiney maggots who haven't even played the X-pack yet, and so have no idea.
     
  2. cowofwar

    cowofwar Peasant

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2000
    Messages:
    13,721
    Likes Received:
    18
    Market Rating:
    0
  3. charlybrown

    charlybrown Peasant

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2001
    Messages:
    991
    Likes Received:
    6
    Market Rating:
    0
    Gambling sure is not the problem, according to my thoughts on my Cool Thoughts thread, you can gamble faster in D2 and you can get frosties for your sor and convert them.

    Yeah somehow the new Magic Iron maiden skill casted by many monsters in act5 seems shoking to me. Your static field does so much damage at a time, wouldn't it just kill the sor witha single static?
     
  4. Moose

    Moose Peasant

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2000
    Messages:
    1,612
    Likes Received:
    2
    Market Rating:
    0
    I think that some classes will be hurting with the pack. I read a sorc take on the matter and he said that it is still doable, just more difficult.

    http://www.diabloii.net/xpbeta/tester-report10.shtml

    Take a look. I like some of his solutions to some of the problems he discusses.

    What he said that really made me think was that magic users can now have a form of "thorns" cast on them. So SF will hurt you as well. He also pointed out that people will shy away from using a sorc for PvP because the cast delay makes them an easy target. No more fast cast as you pointed out.

    I am still really thinking that you hit it on the head with the "whiney maggots who haven't even played the X-pack yet, and so have no idea" statement. Lets wait and see. We may all be pleasantly surprised! Or we may be pissed off beyond belief, but we will all see soon enough.
     
  5. Moose

    Moose Peasant

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2000
    Messages:
    1,612
    Likes Received:
    2
    Market Rating:
    0
    Oh, I should also add that with all this info out there I am getting jackshit done at work. I should have just called in sick. I am going home for lunch. Lurk, maybe I will run into you if you are on.
     
  6. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2000
    Messages:
    2,586
    Likes Received:
    47
    Market Rating:
    0
    Well, I read the article that Cow talked about. This guy has played the beta, so he probably does know a little. He makes all the same points. He said his clvl 50 or so Zon had little problem killing Baal in NM, but his clvl 74 or so Sorc got whipped, especially since Baal uses the magical version of IM.

    Now, I am not much of a Sorc player, but the game is already weighted too much toward the physical chars. I think it's a bad decision to tip the scales even farther in that direction. My fav character is still the Necro, and on the whole it looks like he is escaping the changes unscathed. The IM/BG thing was a bug anyway, and while the increases to the poison skills are dubious, at least they are increases. At worst I will simply ignore the poison branch just like I do now. If their hit points actually do ramp up with difficulty level, Skeletons may actually become useful, whereas I hate them now, and Amp Dmg and Lower Resist are going to be godsends with the immunities that monsters will have, especially in parties. The increased mana cost for BS is okay with me, as long as the damage increase is proportionate.

    The gambling thing does bother me a little bit, I think that's a good point. Rares show up with good physical mods a lot more often than they show up with good magic mods. At least with uniques and sets you know what you are getting. Nothing irritates me more to see a rare wand drop and find out it has leech and enhanced damage. Blizz already makes the + skills mods item specific (you'll never see a wand or staff with +2 to Amazon skills, for example), so why would it be so tough to make the other mods item specific? Rare wands and staves should only get mods like fastest cast and increased mana, not 10% chance of crushing blow. I'm sure that some of the Rune Words and Crafted Items will make good stuff available for the Sorcy and Necro, but they will still have to work much harder to get good equipment.

    Don't get me wrong, I am looking forward to the X-pack, and I think the good points will outweigh the bad ones. But I think all in all you are going to see the use of Sorcys and Necros decline even farther than they are now, and I don't think that's a good thing.
     
  7. Onisama

    Onisama Peasant

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2000
    Messages:
    1,740
    Likes Received:
    0
    Market Rating:
    0
    /warning, the following is heavily laced with sarcasm and teasing. It is not in any way to be taken seriously.

    cough game balance cough cough escalation cough cough told ya so cough gag choke wheeze

    gasp
    someone smack me on the back
    wheeze

    cough cough

    ;) :laugh:
     
  8. Gilgamesh

    Gilgamesh MSC Footman

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2000
    Messages:
    1,759
    Likes Received:
    9
    Market Rating:
    0
    smack.....
     
  9. Lurk

    Lurk Peasant and Donator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2000
    Messages:
    2,586
    Likes Received:
    47
    Market Rating:
    0
    Touche. ;)
     
  10. Haite

    Haite Forum Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2001
    Messages:
    9,325
    Likes Received:
    34
    Market Rating:
    0
    Charged items can be refilled? Everyone knows I'm a big Necro player and this really does suck! I never thought that the poison skills would ever be tweaked enough, this just proves my theory. I suppose the unique gambling thing blows too, but since my Necro is totally decked out now I wouldn't really know how bad this makes things.

    --Haite
     
  11. Moose

    Moose Peasant

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2000
    Messages:
    1,612
    Likes Received:
    2
    Market Rating:
    0
    I will be stocking up on items before hitting the expansion as well. It may be the only way to get some items that are available now, such as frosties and goldwrap.
     

Hitometer: 53,846,708 since 1995